Grand Admiral Thrawn - Blog Posts

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lost in these memories

Tales of the Empire review, the problem with Filoni

Spoilers for "The Path of Anger" below

So, to start off with the obvious, Dave Filoni has never read a single Cannon Thrawn novel. The timeline of events in this episode made no sense for the timeline of the novels. Thrawn was an admiral, yet he was already accompanied by Rukh and Pallean, whom he wouldn't even MEET until he reached grand admiral status. At this point in the Cannon novels, he would have been accompanied by Eli Vanto, not Pallean. In fact, he wouldn't even meet Pallean until the events of Treason. The choice by Folini to overhaul this story erases the conical nature of the "Cannon" Thrawn novels.

Before I get into my real point on the problem with how Filoni writes, I'll give my review of the episode as a whole. It was fine, not much to write home about. The animation was beautiful as to be expected, and very expressive. The writing was... just ok. The empire was depicted as cartoonishly evil, though it is a cartoon so, maybe that's justified. For a short that was supposed to teach us more about Morgan and her motivations, I feel like we didn't learn much about her that we didn't already know? She's good with ship design, she wants revenge and power, etc. Nothing new. Personally, I found the pacing of the episode to be quite boring, it was very slow despite the short runtime. Overall, I don't know if I would recommend it, though I thought the episodes following Barris were quite enjoyable.

Now for the real problem I have with these episodes: Filoni's insistence on his own version of cannon at the cost of others' work. I don't deny Filoni is a good writer and director, Rebels is one of my favorite shows of all time! But he's been on this power trip after being essentially being handed the reigns to Star Wars. There was a period where Star Wars was a collaborative effort between a ton of creatives working on something they loved, the second golden age, that made it into a beloved franchise for a new generation. But now it's just Filoni, and he decides what part of other creative works he'll pick and choose to tell his own story. I feel so bad for Zhan. He created this beloved character, and wrote AMAZING NOVELS, only to have his incredibly complex character be forced into a 2d stereotype. Filoni needs to do better because if he keeps going down the path of writing he has been Star Wars is going to be a shell of its former glory.

He's so trans to me.

who out thinking about the character

Star Wars Rebels art I did, cross-posted from my other account. Close-ups below the cut.

Introspective

Artist: @foreverforty2

Dedicated to: @mysticalgalaxysalad a very kind friend!

No matter what happens in live action, I think we can all use more Thrawn Thirst Traps… in all his iterations he is still a comfort character for many.

While watching Thrawn spar with assasination droids for funsies, I finally gave in. I threw my hands up and said: fine, I’d fuck Thrawn.

A gift for @thespicypapaya, a commission for me done by @blackmonitor of a scene I chose from papaya’s fanfic; Enjoy! https://archiveofourown.org/works/43339410

Rukh Reimagined … for my Thrawn fanfic “Facilitation” on AO3 … warning: extremely spicy … mind the tags

Thrawn: Red & Blue, a gift for @blackmonitor 💙❤️

[ forever_42 ] MasterList of Fiction

[ Transformers Fanfiction ]

new fandom as of April 2024. Art: Prowlastator Fanart 1. TF1 Megatron. Other: Sixshot.

A Question Of Hope

Optimus Prime/Megatron [ complete, 3600 words ]

The conception had been intentional. He had intended the offspring to be used as a tool. A new and very powerful tool by which to torment Optimus Prime.

The one thing Megatron had not correctly anticipated was the effect the sparkling would have upon himself.

Night Shine

Optimus Prime/Megatron [ incomplete, ongoing ]

Perhaps, in time, with this being before him, Optimus could learn to forgive himself for his failure to save the other one.

Optimus Prime finally kills Megatron and ends the war. Decades later, while leading a rebuilt and now prosperous Cybertron, the Prime takes a young lover to whom he feels a strong and unexpected attraction.

At their spark bonding, the mech that Optimus thought was his spouse becomes someone else entirely. Someone he used to know.

Supply Closet 1501D

Prowl/Scavenger [ complete, 2850 words ]

Scavenger is a simpering, stupid mech, and so ugly Prowl has to dim the lights to their lowest setting. However, Scavy’s sweet nature means that he’ll never gloat or brag about secretly spiking his superior in a supply closet every day.

[ original work ] Demons:

Rakul [ incomplete, ongoing ] Content Warning: Non-consent & dark themes. Mind the tags. The Demon King claims his latest virgin sacrifice. And begins a path to atonement. Male/Female demon/human. 6 of 11 chapters, 24579 words with art by author & fanart. Ch.6 art.

Simshian [ incomplete, ongoing ] Pursued by a demon of the castle, the elven Counselor must decide just how much of himself he’s willing to give his unexpected new lover. Male/Male demon/elf. 3 of 6 chapters, 7795 words with smut.

Follow me on Twitter and Instagram [ @ foreverforty2 ]

[ Star Trek Fanfiction ] Vulcans.

Explicit male/female Vulcan/human

His Eyes Speak [ complete ] Vulcans control Earth. A human woman, convicted as a criminal, agrees to endure a sentence of three years punishment as a sex provider for Vulcan males during their pon farr. Not long after the completion of her sentence while on Vulcan, she is abducted by an anonymous former client, taken to his home and used thoroughly… but finds herself submitting willingly to the needs of her intense and possessive captor. 14.6k words with art by author: Art 1, Art 2, Art 3.

[ Star Wars Fanfiction ] Grand Admiral Thrawn.

(all with explicit content)

Facilitation [complete > but more to come… ] A hot Rukh dominates Thrawn and directs Eli in their threesome. 6626 words with art by author.

Miithrawn [complete] A conventional romance with Thrawn x female OC. 21269 words with fanart.

Vun’kebah [complete] Thrawn x female OC, unconventional relationship. 15237 words with fanart.

Embur [complete] Thrawn, Kallus, Zeb x female OC. Crack pwp with random plot. 15688 words with fanart.

Thrawn Fanart: - Introspective - Bowie -

DISCLAIMER. Reading and writing non-consensual sexual fiction is an exploration of fantasy, and is not at all an endorsement of, nor invitation to, non-consent in real life.

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No thoughts, head empty, just Senior Captain Thrawn

So like, I’ve been meaning to hop onto my computer, where I’m logged on to AO3, so I can comment on a bunch of your fics. Particularly your original one. But I keep forgetting to, so I’ll just do it here 😊

I adored your original fic. Power imbalances (especial evil or drastic ones) are my absolute guilty pleasure. Plus your smut was top quality!!

thank you so much 🥹 !! I’m so glad people like my stories… I think my very, very favorite trope is the dark villain who isn’t actually… and I’m still wringing the shit out of that one hard, in every story I’ve written since, I think, lol. The big scary guy, the anti-villain who does bad things for a good cause, and then he cuddles the shit out of you (and fucks you) that gets me going non-stop. And I’m so glad you enjoy my smut too because I don’t know wtf I’m doing there, just writing what I like, or what I’m feeling at the time I guess 😬 (and trying to make it not suck). thanks a lot for the comment!

omg, I wish !!! Lmao !

Special delivery...

Just delivery boy Mitth’raw’nuruodo brings the groceries to @foreverforty2​​ 😇😊

I hope she can pay him. Well, he looks like someone who takes other payments than money… *typical porn music starts*

Commission for precious @cyber-glitch85

Aaaaahhhhh thank you so much 🥹

Illustration of a wonderful fanfiction, Vun’kebah by @foreverforty2

Definitely must-read story!  💙

https://archiveofourown.org/works/39383814/chapters/98560797#workskin

Happy Thrawn Thursday… I’m finally getting my ass in gear, by repeated request of @blackmonitor and publishing my third Thrawn Fanfiction! The story is complete ! enjoy 😉

Warning: Explicit Adult Content!

Mind the tags!

15237 words in 10 chapters.

💎

With a Lovely Illustration by @blackmonitor !!!

Musings On Thrawn

Let me begin this by stating up front; Thrawn is a villain. A brilliant, fascinating, charismatic villain, but a villain nonetheless. He is Holmes and Rommel and Moriarty all rolled into one. (Please don’t hate me for this.)

And I’ve tried to keep that front of mind as I have been writing this massive Alexsandr Kallus fic, Especially now that I am into the cat and mouse section where Kallus is spying for the rebels as Fulcrum, but having to interact with Thrawn on an almost daily basis. 

To prepare to write this I reread all the Thrawn books. I even read the first Heir to Empire, and if people thought Thrawn was vile in Rebels he was far worse in that Legends novel. I’ve also been rewatching a number of Rebel’s episodes.

In the books Tim tries very hard not to have Thrawn be as loathsome as Tarkin or Vader and succeeds, but it’s still important to remember he is not a good, kind man. Yes, he tries to limit civilian casualties… when possible, but he won’t let the death of innocents stand in the way of a victory. In the end it’s always about the cold equation.

In the Ascendency novels he makes it clear to Admiral Ba’kif that he would have destroyed the planet Sunrise and all of its inhabitants in order to destroy the Grysk threat to the Chiss. And he would have leveled Capital City if Ezra had not capitulated.

He also uses and discards his own troops in the service of tactics and strategy. In Treason he cold bloodily sends a number of Tie pilots to their deaths to verify his theory about the alien’s battle tactics. War for Thrawn is like a giant game of tactica or chess.

I do love the fact that Thrawn was the perfect Chiss to send into Lesser Space to serve in the Empire. While Thrawn, unlike many of his fellow Chiss, is able and willing to work with aliens he comes from a culture that is every bit as bigoted as the high human cult in the Empire. Which is another reason he can so easily slide into serving Palpatine.

Basically, he seems to be a man who has great difficulty forming personal relationships. (To be fair Tim has no choice, but to write books that focus on battles and strategy and political skullduggery and not much on the inner lives of the characters, and it certainly provides fanfic authors a rich playing field. Actually that is one of my complaints about the books. Nobody seems to have any personal attachments. Eli blithely waltzes off to the Ascendancy without a thought for his parents, but I digress). 

So, to lay our Blue Meanie on the coach for a moment….

All of his relationships take the form of mentor to mentee whether it’s with Thrass or Ar'alani or Samakro or Che’ri or Faro or Eli. And his emotional reactions to Thrass’ death, or sending away Eli seem very muted. The books do give us a potential reason for this reticence – the loss of the sister. The fear that he would be hurt again makes him avoid deep relationships and leaves him isolated. 

At his core, I think Thrawn is a man of the mind and not the heart. I think he fears strong emotion, passion because it might cloud his judgement, and open him up to pain again. 

All of which combines to make him a tragic figure. Which really is the best kind of villain. The ones who had the possibility to be heroes, but are brought low by their own fatal flaw.

😭😩🥹😍

@foreverforty2 It’s an illustration from her beautiful fanfiction, Miithrawn. You can find it HERE

Thank you so much for sharing that with us! And of course thank you for your help, I’ll be forever in your debt! 

My second Thrawn Fanfiction is up! Complete!

Now with a fanart drawn by @blackmonitor !!!

I approached your Imitation with admittedly more than a little trepidation. The description said that a clone — Thrawn’s clone — was to be babysat. I skipped the fic several time. What I almost did was bypass the chef-d'oeuvre of you catalogue!

Partially, we have an elaborate what-if had Thrawn not experienced life as he did, but this evaluation would be selling the story far short of the masterpiece that it is. It is also a parallel story of sentience, and the realization that the clone — the “it”, the object owned — is indeed an independent, thinking, breathing individual quite apart from its Prime, Thrawn. Echoes of my all-time favourite episode of Star Trek TNG, The Measure of a Man written by the incomparable Melinda M Snodgrass, are tickling my memory…

We know that Thrawn did indeed have a clone in the EU, and when Mara Jade & Luke encountered that clone (still developing) there was a moral/ethical dilemma regarding his right to live, as independent of Thrawn’s crimes (not visiting the sins of the father, etc) When the same dilemma comes to pass in your fic, we are all delighted in the outcome (I know; I read all 60+ comments) Let’s discuss your point of departure in writing this fic:

We’re you inspired by the initial story of Thrawn’s clone (as mentioned above)?

We learn as much about Thrawn as we do about the clone, which I found pleasantly satisfying. Did you intend to make these revelations from the start?

There is altogether a sensual, bittersweet, and incredibly tender mix in this fic. It is powerful & it leaves an imprint. Do you feel these emotions, yourself, as you are writing?

Please feel free to depart entirely from my queries & discuss the genesis of this story as you will.

I am sure that it is patently obvious that I really liked this fic — as intense & cerebral as it often was (with a bit of kink thrown in to keep us warm) I do appreciate the time and effort it took to write, the pleasure it brought me, and most importantly the time you are giving me as you read this overwrought “Ask”

Thank you for this marvellous ask @beebee-76 that is (as is your wont) full of wonderful questions and generous with beautiful praise! Come follow me below the cut as I get to provide background and detail on this clone-centric story!

I first have to comment on your reveal that the summary of this fic—that the clone was to be babysat—put you off it! I am so glad you read it anyway, and I hope that future readers won’t skip it due to that info. I admit I don’t angst too much about summaries but I clearly didn’t do justice to this fic with that one! 😊 But wow, so happy you've dubbed it my chef-d'oeuvre and I can only wonder if it will remain in that #1 position when you’ve finished exploring my fic mansion 😊 What a glorious compliment. I’m just blushing with this “masterpiece” characterization and absolutely thrilled it inspired such interest and these fabulous comparisons (TNG has so many classic episodes and it’s an honor to be an echo of one!)!

So as to your questions and my “point of departure” when writing Imitation…

I usually start writing with just the idea of one thing I wish to accomplish. More often than not, it’s smut related to a specific pairing (since you read all the comments on this fic, you can see how shocked some of my regular readers were at the ‘no smut’ tag!). In this particular case, it was merely to contribute to the Attack of the Clones collection (hopefully with smut).

I am blessed with two online communities of enablers, one for each of my men, and we all decided to write clone-centric fic for a fun challenge. Thus I intended to write a clone Luke fic and a clone Thrawn fic to satisfy both camps 😊 For years I had been threatening a clone gangbang for Mara, and that one came easy (hahah pun assuredly intended). So my pervy general idea going into this one was to give Pryce a little double team action with Thrawn’s clone joining my evil OTP. You can see it didn’t work out quite like I had hoped hahaha!

I also try to (with all my stories) snug them into canon/Legends as close as possible, so I definitely wanted to use the actual existence of Thrawn’s clone in the Hand of Thrawn duology here. Naturally, I decided to set the fic on Nirauan, where we knew our blue stud had a clone in Vision of the Future, and I pulled all the details about the actual room and building/planet where the clone was “grown” from Zahn's book. The difference of course was I had to get Pryce there! But the inspiration from that book pretty much was limited to location and the fact of the clone being a thing in the EU, as well as the Chiss being its intended guardians at the tower. It made sense to me, that Thrawn’s ego would want a clone, so easy enough as a setup right?

You know Mara’s thinking Thrawn must’ve had a nice ass...

You also ask if I intended to make revelations about Thrawn from the start, and the answer is (almost always) to any “did you intend to” “did you plan to” a big loud “NO”.

I wish I could take credit for being smart enough to strategize how to use Thrawn’s clone to teach us about Thrawn himself, but it was accidental! I am the very definition of a pantser and I never outline or plot, I truly let my hands do the typing and follow and discover the story as it comes from fingers to screen, more often than not entirely bypassing my brain. It’s one of my favorite things about writing and of course one of the most frustrating. I can have a very clear idea about what I’m going to achieve with a fic--here it was “Sexy Threesome with Thrawn Clone” and obviously this fic is Not That. The characters always do whatever they want and I just witness and channel. It’s a kind of magic, really, and I know not all writers work the same way as I do, but if I had to put any actual planning or work into writing, I don’t think it would be the same kind of fun it is for me.

As for your beautiful question about feeling the emotions of the fic when I write, that answer is most definitely a big loud ‘YES’, but it’s even louder and bigger when I reread. It’s the ultimate test for me to review and read my story after the fact and if I have those butterflies in the stomach, the chest tightness where it’s warranted, the disgust or dismay or whatever the words are trying to convey, then I know it’s working and I’m pleased. In fact, I have a “butterfly” test when writing smut…there has to be at least one (hopefully more) parts where I have a physical reaction (squees are valid! Covering eyes with “omg did I really write that” mortification is also valid!) or I have to go back and work on more details to capture some sort of visceral, deep feeling with words.  I give myself bonus points if the flutter happens even after repeated rereads 🥂

It’s probably another reason I tend to only write fic with happy endings. I don’t want to finish a story and feel disappointed or sad, I want everyone to be sated, pleased, content, or at least have hope. The few fics I have written that have more ambiguous ends sort of haunt me as a result…

I’m so thrilled that you took a chance on a fic you had doubts about and wound up really liking it! As a fanfic writer, it’s the most rewarding thing in the world to not just have people read my stories, but know that they inspire thought after the fact, that you want to know more about it, the characters, the process, any of that is just warm-fuzzy inspiring and wonderful.  I also love knowing that my story didn’t disappoint, despite your misgivings, and I hope that my “Works” page never does!  Thank you for being such a fabulous, engaged reader.  Please have a Thrawn gif in thanks for this opportunity to gush at you this evening!

again with feral thrawn, trying to improve the image quality

I think if you really want to know what kind of a person Thrawn is, all you have to do is to look at the Empire of the Hand, which is described thusly on Wookieepedia:

“…a confederacy composed of native species that Grand Admiral Thrawn founded in the Unknown Regions that adopted the order and efficiency of Emperor Palpatine's New Order, but without the Emperor's megalomania, the Tarkin Doctrine, and the institutionalized xenophobia…

…an original combination of Chiss and Imperial tactics personally arranged by the Grand Admiral, such as respect of the enemies, careful consideration of soldiers' lives, surgical strikes, demonstrative invasions, preventive strikes and the significant use of intelligence gathering.”

So the Galactic Empire at its most effective without the tyranny, bigotry, fascism, and compulsory membership. Not bad for an organization founded by a warlord.

Also, for anyone who is unfamiliar with the more obscure Legends Thrawn books (pssst! you’re missing out, I gotta say 😉), the Hand is like the little group of friends he made out of the aliens and Chiss at the end of Lesser Evil. Now take that, add everyone in the seventh fleet, and multiply it by a couple tens of thousands, and you have an idea of what it was like.

Plus they eventually developed Chiss-built star destroyers and Stent. How dope is that?!!

Bowie as Thrawn; part image edit, part painting. base image is David Bowie; background by @nasa : “A view of crescent Jupiter from Juno.”

template image under the cut:

Instagram @ forever_42

A lot of fans project onto him many positive characteristics due to the new canon books, but it’s all the same Thrawn, he just gets darker over time.

Old EU/Rebels Thrawn: Ruthless. Coldhearted. Calculating. Mean.

Book Thrawn: Nerd. Socially inept. Meets his crush’s racist parents with a smile. Wants to save everyone in the Galaxy. Writes poetic and emotionally charged farewells. Can’t drive. Likes to cosplay.

It’s more that like the six new Thrawn novels recontextualised him so that a lot of people who read them don’t see him as a real villain anymore, understand that what he is doing is necessary for the greater good, and although the narrative of Rebels had him as a villain, objectively viewing what he actually did against what he threatened to do, he really seems to be not bad on his own merits. Just when following other’s orders is it when he seems evil, like Boba Fett did originally. Personally, I think that the live-action will start off with Thrawn still being the villain, then reveal Ezra to be now allied with him against the Grysk of those novels, have him be training those Chiss children Thrawn kept bringing up. Like if those Grogu experiments from The Mandalorian turned out to be not to give regular people Force powers like people thought, but allow Chiss children to not lose their abilities growing up?

oh boy. honestly (and leaving aside the fact that the post that prompted you to send this ask had a different point) i usually don't answer asks about this topic anymore because it's one of those things where everyone thinks they're right and the discussion just goes in circles because nobody ever wants to admit that the other side might have a point (including myself. i know i'm right. period. jdfhdfh) but i'm in a Mood today lmao.

just so you don’t misunderstand me (because that’s happened so many times i have to say it), no matter how hard i argue for him being a villain, i literally love him so much. he’s one of my favorite characters, if not the favorite character. my #1 blorbo. my glup shitto. and i love when he’s being an asshole. it sounds crass but i love when he has rukh, idk, murder a tractor technician (rest in peace king) or blows up people or bombards innocent civilians. like, people love vader because he’s so iconic right? it’d be boring as hell if he just didn’t mow down rebels on the regular during his Empire Prime Era(TM) yeah? that’s how i feel about thrawn. oof

objectively viewing what he actually did against what he threatened to do, he really seems to be not bad on his own merits. Just when following other’s orders is it when he seems evil

i'm assuming you're talking about book!thrawn? i'm not quite sure what you mean by 'what he threatened to do' but i am saying that maybe he isn't ~evil~ on, like, palpatine levels, but he definitely isn't a good person. i’ll even give you textual evidence to support that claim! since people are so adamant that new canon thrawn is the only valid characterization!

he murders at least two troopers and causes v-wing crashes with casualties to get onto the strikefast

he condones slavery (”imperial assets”) and i literally don’t care if he’s just saying that because he needs to keep his rank or whatever because he could’ve said so much more in that scene (like. “look vanto that fucking sucks but we can’t do anything about it because we’ll get shot” or whatever hsdhf)

he thinks dictatorships are cool and fun, effectively expressing the same views anakin did in aotc (literal quotes: “quick and utter ruthlessness is necessary when the galaxy is continually threatened by chaos” or “the Republic was weak and fragmented [...] The Empire, in contrast, is unified under a single man and a single vision”)

according to thalias, he’d resort to “straight-up, coldhearted murder“ to get out of getting captured

in the ascendancy he does seem to value non-chiss lives in contrast to most of his fellow chiss (and if that isn’t worth thinking about, nudge nudge, the ascendancy doesn’t seem too different to the empire in many respects does it?) but only as long as they’re useful/non-threatening to him (“He cares about non-Chiss lives.” - “Yes, he does. You threaten his people, and see how fast that changes.”)

^ that last point is literally, literally in relation to samakro ordering an orbital bombardment, which. that’s poetic as fuck, my dude.

the whole “i see people as assets” conversation with ar’alani

i could find more but i think i’ve made my point 😶 lesser evil characterizes him as very sympathetic, obviously, but there’s literally quotes like “If you lie to me, I will eventually know that. Do you wish me to explain what would happen then?“ (god i needed to include this quote because hnnn WHAT A GOOD QUOTE)

who does that sound like? that sounds like it’s the same thrawn as in legends and rebels, imo. [happy sigh]

zahn even said that if disney were to make alllll the old shit canon again, he wants the character and story in the canon novels to line up and make sense with the legends novels. i can’t find a source for that now, though, which is regrettable. maybe i dreamed it.

but! from an interview with the verge:

as for your theory about live-action thrawn: noooo way. there’s no way filoni or favreau or whoever writes it actually reads the novels and includes that material in one or more of the upcoming shows. especially stuff about the sky-walkers. or the grysks. i’d be SO HAPPY, even overjoyed to be wrong in this instance but everything we’ve seen so far points to them going in direction of referencing the heir to the empire trilogy. there’s statues of ysalamiri in thrawn’s office in rebels. they canonized mount tantiss on wayland in the bad batch. the mandalorian is set in 9ABY which is exactly when htte is set kshdfdh

look i’d literally love for him and ezra to be allies and fight the grysks and for sky-walker rights and shit but anon. it’s very, very unrealistic that that’s gonna happen :/

awaiting orders